[rant] Ranty McRanty Pants

[wispfox]

I'm apparently going to be unable to sleep unless I let this rant _out_. So. Rant it is! (ok, inasmuch as I'm willing to let my posts be particularly ranty, I guess)


(because I have no idea who is going to spontaneously be paranoid, this is not aimed at anyone on LJ)


By relationship, for the purposes of this rant, I mean any emotionally intimate one, sexual or not.

In a relationship, one would expect that the people involved want to be involved in that relationship. Otherwise, _end the fucking relationship_!

Presuming - since the relationship has not ended as per above - that one wants to be involved in the relationship, it would seem to make sense that one would be trying to put in the time and energy necessary to maintain relationship health. That one would commit to the relationship in question, rather than being half-assed about it, thereby making the other person unsure if you actually want to be there. What's the point of being in a relationship with someone if you're not sure you want to be in it?

Try _talking_ to them about things that you think might make them scared or insecure, rather than deciding that not mentioning things is the better idea. Hell, don't _do_ the things that you think will be make them unhappy, unless a) you've talked to them about it and learned that it's not a problem or that there are things which can be done to help work through it (and that you can, are willing to, and actually _do_ them), b) you've helped them feel secure enough that things that might otherwise have been a problem _aren't_ anymore, or c) you aren't in a relationship with them anymore.

It's not kindness to hide things from people that they should know about, it's rude and hurtful, _EVEN IF THEY NEVER FIND OUT_. And it's condescending to think that you 'know better' than they do about their own mind and wants and needs, which not telling people about the things they should know implies. And, what's the point of doing things that you expect will upset someone you presumably care about?

Lack of investment in a relationship is _damaging_. It's scary, and uncertain, and undermines the trust between people. It's worse, in my opinion, than no relationship at all. And it makes for all _sorts_ of things to work through later on, if one is willing to work through them. Because... if one is in a relationship with someone who won't commit to it, then there must be something wrong. Usually, in my experience, people think the 'something wrong' is themselves. How is encouraging that kind of thinking kind? How is that loving? It is not love to leave people hanging, uncertain. It is cruel. And it is a betrayal of their trust.

If you're going to be in relationships of closeness beyond a certain point, make the decision to do so, and commit your energy and time to it. Be _in_ the relationship, and not just halfway there. Make decisions about it because of the relationship itself, not external forces. Keep the trust of those you are in relationships with by involving them in your life, and in decisions which will affect them. If, however, after putting in the effort to try to make something work - preferably, if possible, by involving both people in investigation and any implementation - there seems to be no way to do so, don't prolong the agony. Make the decision, and end it.

Comments

[brynndragon.livejournal.com]

2 years ago, this would have been fantastic advice for me. I honestly can't say I would've taken it, but I should have. Instead, I've got myself Another Fucking Opportunity for Growth. It's not manure, it's fertilizer! ;P

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

Another Fucking Opportunity for Growth. It's not manure, it's fertilizer! ;P

*chuckle* Indeed!

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

It's not kindness to hide things from people that they should know about [....] And, what's the point of doing things that you expect will upset someone you presumably care about?

You know what the problem is? Some folks will hide things from people because they think telling them would upset them. I still haven't figured out how to explain why the first principle above trumps the second in a case like that.

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

hide things from people because they think telling them would upset them

Yep. But why do them in the first place? Sure, once or twice, I can get - especially if it's not something one understands. But repeatedly?

I've been guilty of the not telling people things, although I note that that was at least partly because I used to have a nasty self-defense mechanism that meant I would actually forget (or near enough to it) that such things had happened. Once I realized I had that, though, I pay more attention (and having people who are less likely to flip right the fuck out about mistakes help, too) and don't let it happen. Indeed, it's part of why I try to tell people things as soon as I realize them.

[vvvexation.livejournal.com]

But why do them in the first place? Sure, once or twice, I can get - especially if it's not something one understands. But repeatedly?

What I'm thinking of isn't along the lines of hiding things they've done, but rather not speaking up when they have a problem with something.

[opalmirror.livejournal.com]

Grumble grumble... not at what you say, but because I relate, I felt this way about some people I was with. People I would put myself out for, and act *in* relationship with, yet they were like 1) comatose and had to be prodded, or 2) merrily going on and making plans without me. So I poked for a while at them and then told them I was going to let it go. I felt either 1) irrelevant in their life (not worth striving to relate to) or 2) irrelevant in their lives (they had more interesting people/things to chase). Grump!!!

Even with discussion, my closest partner at the time said she couldn't figure out why I was doing what I was doing, even though I disclosed all to her as it was developing.

This was the start of the big unraveling. Not that I'm complaining. It was another one of the big prunings that made way for new growth.

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

At least you knew enough - perhaps, were sufficiently self-confident enough - to let it go...

But, yes. Yay for growth!

[fourgates.livejournal.com]

All super-reasonable. A bit in the abstract. Have you tried casting this in terms of needs and expectations?

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

*wry* This is abstract intentionally.

I rant when there is nothing else that I can do, you see. Mostly, I don't get to the point of wanting to rant if there is anything else that I can do.

[psongster.livejournal.com]

Agreed on all counts.

Sorry you were up late feeling ranty ....

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

Agreed on all counts.

Somehow, I'm not surprised! ;)

Up late: is ok. Sometimes the results of good conversation is that I stay up late because my brain won't shut up. *shrug*

Took me an hour to get that post to a point where it felt right enough to post, interestingly enough. Kept wanting to wander, mostly.

[psongster.livejournal.com]

Somehow, I'm not surprised! ;)

Yeah, well ... I had more than one encounter with it this spring ...

Sometimes the results of good conversation is that I stay up late because my brain won't shut up.

My brain does that too ... for all sorts of reasons. After a while it gets to be a real nuisance!

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

Yeah, well ... I had more than one encounter with it this spring ...

Unfortunate, that.

My brain does that too ... for all sorts of reasons. After a while it gets to be a real nuisance!

As long as it doesn't happen too often (and as I get better at being more aware of things before they become problematic, it doesn't), I'm ok with it. I tend to have _other_ reasons for having trouble sleeping, though, unfortunately!

[datagoddess.livejournal.com]

A-fucking-men.

This is relevent to my latest Fucking Learning Experience. Not that pointing any of this out to the other person helped in the slightest...

I'm glad you got the rant off your chest.

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

Not that pointing any of this out to the other person helped in the slightest...

Indeed. Usually, it doesn't, since the other person has to really _understand_ both how the change would be better, and how to _do_ the change. One of the most comment things I notice with this kind of thing is that of paralysis - difficulty with doing _anything_ actively. Which makes it difficult to make necessary changes in one's thinking.

Unfortunately.

[datagoddess.livejournal.com]

Yes, that paralysis was there, too. Starting things, but never even coming close to finishing them. Having great ideas, but not doing anything to make them happen.

It's sad, but I'm learning I can't do anything for someone who has paralyzed themselves.

[jasra]

I completely agree. The part I had trouble with was being dismissed when I said it was time to end it. Twice. It stuck the third time though and we're both much happier.

[wispfox.livejournal.com]

being dismissed when I said it was time to end it.

Ick. Yes. Although, in that case, I think I'd just start making plans toward ending it, regardless of if the other person agreed. If you felt strongly enough about it to say so _twice_, and all.

Hmm. Ok, maybe 'I would like to think that' rather than 'I think I would', since I don't know that I would be able to. Mostly because I'm not sure that I would have been certain that it needed to happen, yet - once I decide such things, I'm decent about _doing_ them.

[jasra]

I think I'd just start making plans toward ending it

That's basically what I did. Mentally I started the separation process. Physically we'd already separated (sleeping on opposite sides of the bed, not spending time together, etc). Once he finally decided to hear me, we sold the house and got separate apartments. And while the split lasted longer this way, we ended up not hating each other and having screaming matches (which I don't cope well with anyway) and being able to work through some issues so it had its pluses (while still having lots of minuses).